More help with evo 8 wasted spark trigger settings

V3 BETA TESTS
1

Hey guys I have made some previous posts about this, I have tried off and on for a while to get my evo 8 to start with v3 to little success.
I have been thinking about the settings,
In v2, the car is set up as 1-2-1-2 on the ignition settings, with a 1 offset, This changes the original firing order from 1342, to 3421. Which matches the injection order (based on end of injection table).
In the new v3 version, there is no setting for offset, so presumably I set the firing order to 3421 which is what the offset would make it. However, I think part of the reason I was having issues, is that if I shift the firing order to 3421, this no longer means the 1-2-2-1 firing order would work as it would be trying to fire ign 1 on cylinder 3, ign 2 on cylinder 1, etc.
that is not how its wired. It is wired as ign1 to cylinder 1-4, and ign 2 to cylinder 3-2.
So in the firing order is 3-4-2-1,
Ign outputs, are set to
firing order 1, cyl 3 to ign 2.
Firing order 2, to cyl 4, ign 1.
firing order 3 to cylinder 2, ign 2,
firing order 4, cyl 1, ign, 1.
This is a configuration I have not tried before,
Previously, I could not get the car to synch or start. The only way I could was by setting the ignition settings to sequential and ign outs to 1-2-1-2 but the timing was way off, and I gave up there.
As I have been thinking about it I came to this realization I have posted.
the other part that is confusing me, is much is assigned to as cylinders, So
If cylinder 3 is always cylinder 3, and cyl 3 is fired by ign out2 (the same as cylinder 2)
then on the ign outs, would it always be, 1-2-2-1 as I was previously instructed as this is simply just setting the ign out to the cylinder, so 3 is 2, 4 is 1, 2 is 2, 1 is 1.
If thats the case I am still at a loss as what to do here, and I am struggling to understand why this is so challenging compared to v2 lol.

I havent been in the garage to test this yet, so I just wanted to ask you smart folks if this makes sense or I am missing something,
Additionally on the injector phase settings previously in v2 I had it set to 1-2-3-4 phase to 3421 such as the firing order, I know this has changed in v3, and though I select the end of inj table the same, do I correspond the injectors to each cylinder as 1-1, 2-2 etc or do they need to follow the firing order as they did in v2?

Thanks for your help!

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image1920Ă—1080 270 KB

v3 new map making.emub3 (61.8 KB)
newest fuel edit.emub (145.2 KB)

1 Like
2

U need the invertphase option. Set firing order to 1342 and set this option and most of ur problems will be solved. I would not manually manipulate the firing order to make it somehow work…i think this makes ur whole setup hyper confusing in other functions.

3

I believe I tried that in the past,
But I will try again,
For learning sake what is it that the invert phase does exactly? Does this replace the offset from v2?

4

Yes…this replaced the offset option.

5

That makes sense,
I will give this a shot, I have an experienced emu tuner going to help me set this up who’s done v3 but I just want to get the car to hopefully start prior to that.

6

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try this
i wonder if in v3 emu can somehow use both rising and falling edge at primary trigger (like link does)to get better resolution from that 2 teeth crank trigger wheel ancient technology.

7

Unfortuantelly this trigger wheel is uneven on both edges.
There is a simple solution. There are many 12-1 or 18-1 triggers wheels on the market like:

Simple solution that gives very precise timing

1 Like
8

Thanks guys. So I have an update.
I tried the oem firing order with invert phase. This did not work, I tried both sequential and wasted spark mode neither worked.

I then tried 3421 firing order, and this worked finally, it did work in wasted spark mode as well.

Finally got the car started and minus running rich and some other issues it seemed to be running well enough.
I am curious as to what I should do with the firing order concern.
Presumably manually setting the order this way should be fine, as it is in v2 and there is no firing order selection in v2.

I am worried that this modified firing order may have other issues, @Jadzwin_ECUMASTER can you tell me if running the car this way is safe,
IE; all other firing order parameters or data drawn from this will repeat from this setting and no other.
I just want to make sure something else isn’t affected by this that I’m not aware of.
I assume it’s okay as it has been in v2. But just want to be sure.

I understand if the trigger wheel causes issues with a lack of clarity and I need to manually change the firing order, this doesn’t seem problematic to me, but I just don’t know.

I don’t feel like pulling the timing cover off right now hahah, as it’s worked great with v2 I assume the v3 has the same parameters to allow it to work just as well for now. Though it is a common upgrade to update the trigger wheel on this car. I will in the future next time I have it apart.

1 Like
9

Here is the map and log,
I do have the car set to wasted spark setting now, and it’s running well however the car with the same VE from v2, and same injector settings from v2 is running much more rich.
Can anyone look at my v2 map vs the v3 and tell me if they see anything I’m missing as for the car needing less fuel?
Cheers.

v3 new map making.emub3 (62.3 KB)
v3 running.emublog3 (1.1 MB)

11

Invert phase in the case of 4 cyliner engines changes from 1342 to 4213.
You want to change offset by 180 deg not a 360
You can do it as you did or just change the first trigger tooth.

It is ok.

12

Check your fuel regulator settings as in V3 it is considered in fuel equation

13

That makes sense, I will leave it as 3421 then that seems simplest.
But what would I need to change on the trigger tooth settings? How exactly would I set it to accomplish the same firing order?

And that may be right, I think I selected the map+ reg setting. I’ll check it out. Thank you sir!

14

Turns out it was the fpr setting but also the ethanol content settings i input into the car. V2 doesn’t have this feature so when I input 70% it assumed I had 70% more ethanol than I actually am tuned for.
This is a very nice feature. Does this mean if I can input the various content %’s and it will semi adjust the fueling?

Also, can you tell me within my map, why my airflow idle pid control is not active? I have settings put into it,
I can get the ignition to work, but not the airflow pid

15

@Jadzwin_ECUMASTER
I found the ethanol content table adjustment.
I would like to make my current VE read for 70% Ethanol.
It would be a nice feature to be able to
“set current VE to X ethanol” or something of the sort, instead of having to redo the VE completely around that automatic calcuation.
Additionally, if I use a preset ethanold percentage here,will it attempt to blend tables like flex fuel etc?
cheers

16

please explain me what do you want to achieve.
It should be possible right now.

Did you tune the ve with the 70 percebt ethanol and now you want to adjust ve table to regular fuel ?

There is no need to blend ve tables as now the ethanol content is a part of fuel calculation model.

But you can still enable VE ethanol blend if you want.

17

So in this table,
It shows the adjustment for ethanol blend.
the car was tuned in v2 (with 70% ethanol)
When I bring the VE into v3, it would be for 0 percent ethanol on the table as I would want no change.
If I input 70% blend, it will change the table to 29% more fuel.
Inorder to make this table work 70% would have to be 0.
but I cannot give negative numbers for the lesser contents, I can increase 5-10% in the higher content.

So I would like to put 70% ethanol content into the ECU but I do not want the 29% added fuel. if that makes sense.
In order to make this would I would need to add 29% to the VE table across the board, and then the calculation would be correct

the car is permenantly on e85, but sometimes in the winter the % drops to 65% and in the summer can go back up to 85% usually I am at 70% however, it would be nice to input 80% and use the increase, which I can do now as the table is shown.
What I cannot do is input 65% as there is no way to make a negative trim from 0% (what is actually 70)

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this is the original calculation which will simply add 29% to my VE which will be too rich

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18

So in general you need to decrease the whole table by 29%
It is quite simple. Just mark all VE table cells and enter 0,81* or 0.81* depends on system decimal point.
That will scale the whole table.

Then enter 70% ethanol content in Fueling / General ethanol content or select Gasoline + ethanol, flex fuel mode for Fuel composition if you use flex fuel

19

That makes sense, I was just hoping to keep my VE numbers relevant to the actual tune but this makes sense and is the easiest way